Analyst - "Borderlands has been sent to die."
On yesterday's Bonus Round on GameTrailers, Wedbush Morgan Analyst Michael Pachter had this to say about Borderlands, which releases tomorrow.
Sent to die. I think “Borderlands” is the definition of a game that should have had it’s own window and not be up against all this stuff. It’s absolutely the same audience. I don’t think it’s as much an RPG as they would like us to believe. If it’s an RPG, “Dragon Age” is going to kick its butt; and if it’s a shooter, “Call of Duty” or something else is going to kick its butt.
There's a wildcard at play though here that Mr. Pachter neglected, and that's the full extent of the co-op support that Borderlands has versus the other two games mentioned.
For one, Dragon Age has absolutely no co-op, RPG fans will have to look elsewhere for their co-op experience.
Modern Warfare 2? It has a co-op mode, one that many previews seem to say is a blast to play, but it's missing a core co-op component. Ya know, because it broke the experience.
So while some may think Borderlands will get lost in the shuffle this fall, I know there's quite a few people in our community that plan on picking it up. It'll do just fine, and things will keep going strong once the DLC hits down the road. It may not sell as well as it could had it been released earlier this year when there was a glut of gaming, but saying it will "die" is a stretch.
Source: Link 
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Biohzrd451 at 05:53 AM on 10.19.2009
Is this guy serious? Yea sure you can get the next cookie cutter CoD game, or you can get a good RPG experience that appeals to the hardcore players from Dragon Age... but doesn't he really thing people are not going to be interested in a game that not only puts the two experience together but does it in a manner that can be approached by even a casual gamer.Dunno just doesn't sound like this guy has done his homework.
Zonf86 at 05:56 AM on 10.19.2009
I can see where he is coming from, no doubt borderlands will suffer from MW2 and other big hitters.I bet MW2 is ultimately what swung the balance/convinced a lot of devs on tight scehdules to push back to next year.
smurphster at 05:59 AM on 10.19.2009
true... but you can't keep pushing a title in fear that it won't stand up against the rest. there are big titles every year as well as titles that fall by the wayside. i think borderlands is different enough that it will stand on its own. it may not have the best sales out of the gate but it will do well.
TheReaperCooL at 06:13 AM on 10.19.2009
I have the game for X360, and I can say that it's kickass!!!I don't care if Dragon Age is an RPG where you can develop relationships with other characters, and I don't care that you need to shoot terrorists and stuff in MW2.
What I do care is that THIS game is different from other games, and THAT's why everyone who don't like new things say that this sucks. This game HAS potential, and it's not the same game with different models, maps and stuff.
This... is a masterpiece, no matter what "professional reviewers" say
Zonf86 at 06:15 AM on 10.19.2009
I agree, you can't put it off too long. However, there are few games that will be bigger than the likes of MW2.
I of course want Borderlands to do well, but we can't deny that MW2 will most likely have a larger than normal impact on sales. It's not that the game doesn't stand out/stand on its own... but the fact that many people only buy one or two games a year. And these will more than likely be the BIGGEST games.
Deriaz at 06:19 AM on 10.19.2009
I had a giant rant thing to say, about how he's ignorant and not looking at the whole title. I guess I can just sum it up:Borderlands is not Call of Duty or Dragon Age. It's a unique game -- "massively co-op" as the first guy said. Saying Borderlands is "sent to die" by comparing it to Call of Duty or Dragon Age is basically saying, "It's not Call of Duty or Dragon Age. It'll fail." Sorry, I like having variety. I would prefer having unique games that offer different game styles than having 5 versions of Call of Duty to select from. That's just me, though.
Reviewers/Analysts need to stop comparing games with new, fresh (or even polished, as Hellgate: London did RPS as well though failed) games to stale titles (Call of Duty). I can understand looking at it from a market perspective, but saying "Sent to die" when the game hasn't even been released and you don't even know the sales is just jumping the gun to try and look smart.
(Complete side note: Am I the only one who thinks Dragon Age looks average at best, if not bad? I didn't know there was no co-op.)
justabaldguy at 06:36 AM on 10.19.2009
BURN! Nice one Smurph.
TheReaperCooL at 06:38 AM on 10.19.2009
No, you're not the one Deriaz who thinks that Dragon Age is "just an average RPG". I have the same thoughts.It will be bloody and you can develop deeper relationships with characters. That's all that stands out for me, and when I realised that there's no Co-op, then I said Then I don't need this, thanks.
BTW Hellgate London was a great game, I would like to play with it, but there's no LAN option. The servers were shut down in 1 year, killing the whole game. THAT's why I say that you should include a LAN option for a multiplayer game, so we could play it afterwards.
Deriaz at 06:41 AM on 10.19.2009
I loved Hellgate: London as well. Two friends and I played that game a lot -- myself and another one almost lifetime subscribed, too. We loved it, because it was like an online version of Champions: Return to Arms that we could play. Only downside was that there was no money pool to buy chips and drinks; that was your own problem to solve if we played that night. This actually gives me an idea of how to survive to tomorrow. Hellgate: London marathon! I can then just loop Ain't No Rest For The Wicked in the background, and pretend the demons are actually just. . . Really freaky bandits or something. ;D
ShadokatRegn at 06:45 AM on 10.19.2009
I think this will be my "Please! I need this for Christmas or the world will end!" gift. There are so many people dying to get their hands on it, I don't see it fizzling out at all. 
paketep at 06:53 AM on 10.19.2009
They killed MW2 for PC. Even if it sells millions. fargo1019 at 07:10 AM on 10.19.2009
Call me weird, I guess, but Borderlands is on my shopping list and the other two ain't. smurphster at 07:12 AM on 10.19.2009
ditto
Biohzrd451 at 07:19 AM on 10.19.2009
In the same boat, not even interested in the others at all.
Willtur at 07:23 AM on 10.19.2009
Seriously this game does have a ton of rpg to it and the game is highly addictive. This has got to be if not the best game I have played ever, it is definitely the best in recent memory. I can go down the list but if you had to choose there isnt another game out there worth buying more.Btw not a pirate, brother in law works at a gamestop near my work, i get them in advance and he rings them up first thing that morning. I bought 4 copies and played for 14 hours straight with 3 other peeps not one of us looked up to check the time. Even when we noticed we still played on. Speculation by that guy is way off especially when word of mouth starts hitting.
Biohzrd451 at 07:25 AM on 10.19.2009
I both love and hate you at the same time for having the game early lol.
Shazoo at 07:34 AM on 10.19.2009
he's basing the fact that its not a competitive type shooter game to be on par with MW2 and it's not a hugely time sink in depth game to be on par with any RPG. Truth to the matter is, it's a nice balance between the two and it will probably knock him on his face when it releases to the public. I'm in the same boat most of you are, in that I dont plan on buying MW2, but I do plan on getting BLs. 
blakepro at 07:35 AM on 10.19.2009
I think the co-op aspects of the game really set it apart from the other two games he mentions.Also, those other two games are really really focused in one particular area where borderlands has a broad range of things they are bringing to the table. Yes, the other two games might do FPS really well, and RPG really well, but borderlands is bringing a wider range of things like RPG elements to a shooter, Four player co-op, four different play styles with three different skill branches for each class, 87 bazillion guns, and just a unique experience over all.
The other games will likely be great, but they also just feel like a polished up version of what has already been done. No one has really done what gearbox is doing with borderlands. They are taking a risk by not just pumping out a sequel to an established franchise or by not just staying in the parameters of typical games. I hope it pays off for them. All too often, it seems that developers are punished for being creative in a world where madden sells millions every time it releases with its incremental upgrades...
smurphster at 07:42 AM on 10.19.2009
so true... it makes me sick.
bigtex at 09:55 AM on 10.19.2009
Unfortunate to hear. However, I know I pre-ordered mine and have been anxiously awaiting every tid-bit of news for months. I crave Co-op! As I'm sure other readers on this site do. For me and my group of 8-10 friends picking it up, I know we simply can't wait!Heck, I've been re-playing Too Human for 2 months waiting for this game. The other games mentioned aren't even on my list of wants.
In fact, I'm only after this, and Lost Planet 2, and that doesn't come out until February.
BigBadBob113 at 10:31 AM on 10.19.2009
As far as Im concerned, Borderlands appears to be a multi-player version of Fallout, with the combination FPS and RPG. Fallout did just fine, and last I checked had a nice GOTY edition come out.I think his basis is horrible. Im pretty sure the game will be selling plenty of copies.
TheReaperCooL at 10:49 AM on 10.19.2009
IGN got a review of this game, they gave it an 8.8, which I think is not a score for a game that "has been sent to die." Willtur at 10:54 AM on 10.19.2009
Seriously! I have seen some reviews out and it disgusts me, how can you give a game like COD4 a 9.4 even though its value for single player was about 5 hours? Halo ODST had only 5 hours campaign gameplay also. These games are low on content and get way repetitive but were a blast to play through, I am fine with the 9.4 and dropping 60$. But then a game comes out with a at least 80 hours of gameplay with two player splitscreen, 4 player system link and online and is some how fun to play every second of it and it gets an 8.8 and below. Seriously wtf is wrong with these reviews? It has a ton of gameplay in single player and btw, play the whole thing with your friends if you feel so inclined. Hey would you like to do some DM every now and then? well go ahead and hit an arena or challenge a friend to a duel. Want to bring your character over to your friends game? Go right the F on then. This game is pure sex with bananas and these guys are on crack.
Even Diablo had lows where you had to go back here or talk to this guy or find this. This one doesnt have any of that, that's why it's so hard to put down.
TheReaperCooL at 10:56 AM on 10.19.2009
Willtur I remember that when GameSpot scored 5.0 for Monster Hunter and 9.2 or how many for Crysis.Crysis is just eye-candy, while I still play Monster Hunter these days. Hell, I'm even ready to buy a Nintendo Wii once Monster Hunter Tri comes out here
Shardik at 11:12 AM on 10.19.2009
Kotaku has a review too, they loved it also. The only thing they didn't like were the map, and how it had a little bit of grindy in single player like an mmo. Still can't wait for this game! 
Sabre at 12:35 PM on 10.19.2009
Reviews are subjective and not simple maths. If it was maths only, unlimited saga would be the best game ever made. Never heard of unlimited saga? There is a reason.
However, the problem with most reviews atm is hype, as is the fan backlash. Perfect example is MGS2 and Mario Sunshine. Two games that got perfect scores, but were famously not all that.
There is also the so called 3 point scale, something this site is guilty of. The idea of rating a game out of 10, but 95% of the time they only use 7-9.
Then there is sensationalism, polatics and agregate rigging. Most famous examples being zelda wii getting 8.8 and Trackmania getting 0/10. The goal is to bring in the site views, bring down the average to what you believe it should be, or to make a political statment. How many people said Resident Evil 5 was racist? 1 american dude, and everyone else jumpped on the bandwagon.
Lastly, there is simple bribery. ANY review site paid for by advertisments is at least on thin ice. Quite simple. Give us a good review and your site/magazine/show will get X.
Mrxknown_JG at 03:03 PM on 10.19.2009
Think about this way, MW2 is an established franchise. They already had millions of players ready to buy it when they beat CoD:MW back in 2007!Borderlands is an new IP and that's the kicker. No demo, lost of new an creative mechanics, but it's not a proven seller. Nor is Borderlands a cookie cutter game that fits one set demographic.
The advantages it has is also it's weaknesses. Only tomorrow will tell how well it sells and then by the end of this week will we know how well (if at all) is was received.
It's an unknown...I get that.
I'm still buying it in 4 HOURS!
xxW4R EAGL3xx at 03:40 PM on 10.19.2009
I can see what the guy means but come on! Borderlands looks great BECAUSE it's different. EXAMPLE I like pizza, but if I ate it everyday I'd get bored. Sabre at 04:01 PM on 10.19.2009
This the old 'money men vs creative' argument. The gist of it goes like this.
The creative, who believes everything he does will be his magnum opus and that everyone everywhere will want to play it. Even I think this way despite the obvious truth.
The money men see the games as just a thing to sell. They want something that has sold before. Something recognisable and safe that they peddle to get money.
When a creative does do right, that becomes the new safe and marketable. Look at all the sci fi shooters post halo, the rash of crap horror games on the PS1 in the wake of resident evil or the current open world trend still going strong years after gta3. The wheel will be rolled until someone changes it, then that will be the new wheel. This always has been the case.
HobocidalManiac at 07:25 PM on 10.19.2009
I didn't read the article being discussed, but I love how he says Borderlands is being sent to die while MW2 basically told it's entire PC audience to kindly frak themselves. And I'm very excited for Dragon Age. No co-op is a bummer, though. But not every game needs it (just most of them). TheReaperCooL at 11:36 PM on 10.19.2009
It's interesting that GameTrailers' reviewer gave it an 8.4 score. This score still doesn't resemble a dieing game... Biohzrd451 at 01:44 AM on 10.20.2009
Heheh yea the guy sure called it huh? rofl.
Picking up my copy in 4 hours woot!
HobocidalManiac at 06:44 AM on 10.20.2009
There were people lined up at both Wallmarts I went to last night. Dieing game, huh? The first Wallmart ran out of copies. Deriaz at 07:00 AM on 10.20.2009
GameStop's back shelf was lined with copy after copy of the game. I think the pre-order stack was as large as the release copy stack, as far as I could tell.Kind of cool, too: 10 AM, store just opened, and there were people hanging around talking about how great the game looked, what kind of guns they hoped to find, excited about things they saw from live streams. . .
. . . It definitely had that whole "sent to die" feel to it, yup.
TheReaperCooL at 10:12 AM on 10.20.2009
Now we should say that he made a BIG mistake, and this game even made it to the Game of the Year competition. So it will definitely be in one of the categories, and I hope it will win one of them (maybe Best New IP one? ).So let's all forget this "dieingness", and lets go play!!! I mean you guys go and play, I'm waiting for the PC version
morose at 08:25 AM on 10.21.2009
The main reason to ignore the analyst? Nearly a month of sales for Borderlands before CoDMW2 and a couple weeks before Dragon Age hits the shelves. That IS a window. Plus I don't see Dragon Age being much of a direct competitor... truth be told. MercyfulFate at 10:28 AM on 10.21.2009
Wait, what? Borderlands is awesome!This is one of the first games that I feel truly does co-op right. Frankly it's boring playing alone after doing split screen.
I mean Army of Two was alright, but it was far too short with little replayability. Kane and Lynch was cool but not executed really well, and MW2 only has a co-op MODE.
Mrxknown_JG at 07:11 PM on 10.21.2009
Based from this IGN article. Seems like some stores are running out of copies too fast, They can't seem to met the demand! I hope that bodes well for the sales figures of Borderlands. Login to Co-Optimus to comment.
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